> Not sure I follow this. Pre-ordering books is a pretty well established practice among publishers ...
The difference is the person pre-ordering can back out, and generally speaking in pre-orders, no payment is made until delivery. It ends up being a measure of public enthusiasm, not a way to gather revenues in advance of delivery. In this case, people are paying for a book that doesn't exist yet.
> Actually, it's the primary hack for getting on best-seller lists
Yes, true, but see the pre-order discussion above -- generally, no money changes hands until the book is actually available.
Also, I have to add, the ultimate best-seller-list hack is to buy copies of your own book and put the copies back into the pipeline, endlessly, as the Scientologists are said to do.
> Or is this a more basic "No one should sell anything that doesn't already exist" argument?
But that's true in general -- in the worst cases, where delivery doesn't happen, the seller can be charged with fraud. I hasten to add I am not comparing this hypothetical (but all too common) outcome with the book under discussion, which for all I know is perfectly worthwhile.
Ok, but you didn't address my point about concert tickets et al. Obviously you pay in advance of seeing the concert, or attending the conference, and sometimes these things get canceled.
It's reasonable to expect money back, or worst case some sort of "raincheck" in case of a cancelation or delay. Same applies to ebooks in my mind.
"Public enthusiasm" doesn't pay the deposit for a concert hall or conference center, right? Why should an author not get paid in advance of the effort of writing a book? [Hint: authors already figured this out a couple of centuries ago - thus the publishers' advance]
So it's not really a question of money changing hands, it's just whose money, and whose hands.
> Ok, but you didn't address my point about concert tickets et al.
Fair enough. A concert doesn't work like a book -- the concert venue must know who is coming, in what numbers, in order to prepare. A traditional book publisher only needs to know enough to decide on the size of the next "printing", to fill the supply channel incrementally, as demand warrants.
The concert happens all at once, so the audience size must be known up front. The book publication might stretch over decades, with periodic decisions about the size of the next printing, so the publisher only needs to know the rate of change in demand, the "first derivative," to use the calculus term.
Two very different cases, from very different, non-comparable businesses.
Yes, of course, I'm not making an argument that concerts and books are the same business. That would be dumb.
I'm saying rather, there's no obvious reason to not get paid for them the same way, as long as the audience is willing. If they're not willing, that obviously won't work. But clearly in some cases (like the OPs), they are willing.
So as an author, you'd have to be irrational to not want to be paid as early as possible.
As a purchaser, you're free to vote with your wallet, and not pre-buy anything you don't want to. But if you want what the author is proposing, and want to give him encouragement by pre-buying, why is that somehow bad or wrong?
And my fuzzy calculus aside, the first printing for most books will also be the last one. So better to get the volume right. If only there were a way to accurately gauge demand before doing a printing...
> And my fuzzy calculus aside, the first printing for most books will also be the last one.
This is not the norm in publishing, at least, the desirable kind. For most publishers who promote and market books, profits don't start until the first printing has sold out and subsequent printings begin, with (a) all book preparation activities already complete, and (b) a public who don't need to be persuaded of a book's value. It is at this point that an author begins to be looked on as more than a one-trick pony.
Imagine a pre-publication advertisement: "A truly epic myth! Floods, plagues, the anguish of being unimaginably stupid! Certain to be a best-seller if the author ever gets done writing it! Pre-order the Bible now -- get in before the rush!"
:)
> If only there were a way to accurately gauge demand before doing a printing...
In modern publishing, there's no need -- books are printed, one copy at a time, when they are ordered. For example, my book only gets printed after someone buys a copy. This change (electronic on-demand publishing) essentially wipes out the traditional publishing model.
I think we all know what Print on Demand is, but that Wikipedia page doesn't list any proof for your assertion that it is "the coming thing." The only publishers it lists as offering POD are specialty POD publishers.
That's hardly the sweeping industry change you described.
"In modern publishing, there's no need -- books are printed, one copy at a time, when they are ordered… This change (electronic on-demand publishing) essentially wipes out the traditional publishing model."
This implies that this is the way things are, now, or will be in the very near future, for the majority. And there's no proof that "in modern publishing, books are printed, one copy at a time."
> This implies that this is the way things are, now, or will be in the very near future, for the majority.
And? It's a reasonable prediction based on current trends, and see below for more evidence.
> And there's no proof that "in modern publishing, books are printed, one copy at a time."
What? That's true -- it is how "modern publishing" is distinguished from old-style publishing. This is not to say that the majority of books are published that way, but then I never made that claim.
In modern publishing, books are "printed" one copy at a time, when they are ordered. How is that remotely controversial? It covers on-demand publishing as well as e-books:
Quote: "Whilst the market has seen significant growth since 2008, the last 12 months in particular has shown a substantial rise. Between January 2011 to January 2012, sales in adult eBooks grew by 49.4%, while sales in children and young adult eBooks grew by 475.1%, according to the AAP. The good news for digital publishers is this trend is expected to continue."
Quote: "An electronic book (variously, e-book, ebook, digital book, or even e-editions) is a book-length publication in digital form, consisting of text, images, or both, and produced on, published through, and readable on computers or other electronic devices.[1] Sometimes the equivalent of a conventional printed book, e-books can also be born digital. The Oxford Dictionary of English defines the e-book as "an electronic version of a printed book" ...
The difference is the person pre-ordering can back out, and generally speaking in pre-orders, no payment is made until delivery. It ends up being a measure of public enthusiasm, not a way to gather revenues in advance of delivery. In this case, people are paying for a book that doesn't exist yet.
> Actually, it's the primary hack for getting on best-seller lists
Yes, true, but see the pre-order discussion above -- generally, no money changes hands until the book is actually available.
Also, I have to add, the ultimate best-seller-list hack is to buy copies of your own book and put the copies back into the pipeline, endlessly, as the Scientologists are said to do.
> Or is this a more basic "No one should sell anything that doesn't already exist" argument?
But that's true in general -- in the worst cases, where delivery doesn't happen, the seller can be charged with fraud. I hasten to add I am not comparing this hypothetical (but all too common) outcome with the book under discussion, which for all I know is perfectly worthwhile.