I use to feel contempt for people really proud of graduating college. The actual college courses were all pretty easy compared to the difficulties of the rest of life at the same time - caring for family members, scraping together rent, etc. Someone proud of graduating college when all they had to do in the 4 years was study was upsetting to me.

I have a more mature perspective now, you never know what struggles people have and the courses are really tough for a lot of people.

> I use to feel contempt for people really proud of graduating college. The actual college courses were all pretty easy compared to the difficulties of the rest of life at the same time - caring for family members, scraping together rent, etc. Someone proud of graduating college when all they had to do in the 4 years was study was upsetting to me.

>

> I have a more mature perspective now, you never know what struggles people have and the courses are really tough for a lot of people.

Well done on you! I occasionally run into past versions of you. They usually dismiss my BSc degree and my MSc degree with an attitude that is similar to:

"I learned real lessons at the school of hard knocks. While you were partying with your college friends and memorising useless theory, I was making ends meet and learning practical programming by actually doing it."

Truth is, I've never been to f/time university. After school I (very briefly) apprenticed as a auto mechanic for a short while, then left to work in a factory assembly-line (12-hour shifts, all night-shift, 7 days a week) for a little more peanuts than an apprenticeship paid.

I used almost all of my meagre income to pay for part-time university (work at night, study+sleep during the day). Halfway through my second-year courses I finally caught a break and got a job as a computer-lab assistant at a nearby university.

It wasn't actual programming work (show new students how to log in, refill printers with paper, help students who destroyed or lost their access cards, etc), but it left me a lot of free time to waste on usenet, which is where I found my first actual programming job.

I don't narrate my origin story to those past versions of yourself, though. There's no point. Their self-identity includes their own bootstrapping story about how degrees are pointless.

I have no idea how one flunks the kindergarten, but I’m pretty sure that it does not reflect one’s intellect in anyway.

Am pretty sure there’s an interesting story there somewhere :)

Out of curiosity, I found a sample kindergarten curriculum for the province of Ontario in Canada. [0]

Children as young as four in the province are evaluated by educators on (pages 306–308): the development of the ability to interpret and respond to basic communication, demonstrate independence and "self-motivation" in learning, giving and accepting constructive criticism, developing problem solving skills ("e.g. trial and error, checking and guessing, cross-checking), personal hygiene, self-control of emotions, assertiveness when feeling safe or uncomfortable, and other skills. Indicators that educators look for include phrases from children such as "I'm really frustrated" (page 161) as a demonstration as an awareness and ability to label emotions; "I put my vehicle on the shelf so it would be safe" (page 167) as evidence of problem-solving ability; and persistence in difficult games (e.g. card games and outdoor children's games).

I was also curious whether education in kindergarten could actually have a causal effect on improving long-term outcomes. I couldn't find an immediate conclusion on whether or not interventions are effective, but in at least one paper, it's treated as established knowledge that interventions work. From a quick search, a longitudinal study published in a paper called "Task-Oriented Kindergarten Behavior Pays Off in Later Childhood" [1] with 2837 participants showed a correlation between self-regulation skills in kindergarten and long-term outcomes. The researchers wrote that "early screening by teachers [in kindergarten] introduces the possibility of preventing future learning and behavioral difficulties." They also asserted that "classroom engagement is malleable and amenable to interventions."

While causality was not clearly established in this paper alone, it looks like a reasonable prediction from the correlation that improving classroom engagement as early as in kindergarten could plausibly lead to better life outcomes in years later in life.

TL;DR: While kindergarten in Ontario in recent years may have different expectations than the commenter's time in kindergarten, it appears that educators do evaluate young children on general life skills (e.g. self-control and ability to be aware and label emotions) as a screening tool, and also potentially for interventions to improve engagement in the classroom (which could plausibly lead to better outcomes in years later in life).

[0] PDF, 2016: https://files.ontario.ca/books/edu_the_kindergarten_program_...

[1] 2013: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23369956/

I did flunk Kindergarden. In the early 70's (during the later parts of the Vietnam war.), they had something called Early Primary in Corte Madera, Ca.

I remember all the children had to go up to the calendar on the blackboard once a month and put the day, date, and year The teacher would whisper in our ears where to put the plackard on the black board. If you failed--you had to do it the next day.

I just couldn't remember what she whispered in my ear while walking up to the calendar on the chalk board. Looking back it was nerves. We just had to move the pre printed plackard to the right spot.

The children used to yell "right--left. I would go to 30-31 places until they clapped. (The kids were on my side. They wanted me to succeed.

I was frozen with embarrassment though.

I think I had some learning disability, or emotional problem.

I just remember I had a hard time learning. In all honestly, I just wanted hide in the playhouse from the other children. I was basically very shy, and nervious.

That's when they put me in Early Primary.

It didn't bother me because 1/3 of the class was with me.

My family moved two years later to San Anselmo.

I was happy. My father, and mother were happy. My dad bought a four bedroom home. We all had our bedrooms. I love life, but my family more.

When I entered 2nd grade, I became worried. These new kids had no problem answering questions the teacher would ask.

I------would just cower in fear hoping she would ask me anything. Well--she didn't overlook me, and I would just freeze in fear when she would ask me to repeat what she just said. (Looking back it was basically nerves, but maybe a learning problem? 99.99% of me now feels it was just nerves.

Ok--it's the 70's, and teacher, and my mom, had an unusually long conference.

They held me back again. They put me in this worthless Speech class. I was a studder. "A, E, I, O, U, any Y." Repeated in a route manner. It made no sence to my young self.

I did have a younger sister whom would remind Everone that we were three years apart in age, but 1 year apart in school. There was always a silence from intelligent adults, or an uncomfortable silence from the rest.

By the time I got to the 3rd grade, I knew I just could be held back again.

By the time I was in 7th grade, I was a B to A student. Everything just clicked in.

High school seemed easy, but it was only until my last year I took it serious.

Most blue collar kids knew nothing about good/bad colleges. My sister, and myself, knew nothing of the SAT. It probally didn't help that my Electrican father thought "College boys were tax dodgers." (It was a different time in America. If you didn't go to college, it didn't matter. A union job was a test away.

OK, Iloved my father, but didn't want his life, including the drinking, and Archie Bunker mentality.

I ended up working my junior year in highschool, and going to College of Marin. Back then it was called the Little Berkeley. It was a great school for many years. Those two years were with the cost!

I wanted to become a doctor for all the wrong reasons, basically I could memorize visually all those biology charts, and organic reactions. It just came so easily.

I needed a 4 year degree though. I went to --- ------- state for the four year degree, and graduated. I also had a very aggressive girlfriend at the time, and I knew she would hold it against me if I graduate from that joke of a school.

I had a panic attack while I was in graduate school on december 24th. It was probally comming. I was very much a hypochondriac at the time, and actually believed I has a brain tumor. I tried to go back to school every month for a year, but was just a neurotic mess. I went from being the most capable guy in the room to not being able to drive a car.

I was so neurotic. My girlfriend was a saint though. I had this period where I though sex was making my head pain worse.

We are talking about a 19 blond virgin until we became a couple. She believed my bullshit until she saw a Woody Allen movie with her mother. I belive it was Hanna, and her Sisters.

All I knew was I had this head pain, and life seemed to short. I had a hard time repressing my sexual desires. I had a hard time sitting in school--delaying gratification. I did know that the worst day in college was better than any job blue collar jobs though.

(Why did I write this? I use HN as. journal. My respect for this site has dwindled. When Dang isn't hellbanning me for no reason------I will write. It's not for anyone's benefit except myself, unless it comes to real subjects. I am not going to edit this, especially after a bottle of wine.)

I flunked kindergarden PE.

Too many times, the class was supposed to line up at one side of the gym, then one at a time each kids was supposed to do the thing.

I was never good at waiting in a "useless" line.

Oh agreed, and and I'm definitely biased towards my degree. What I can say is that without the degree I find it extremely unlikely I would have gotten the job I have now working in Data. At the least it gave me the confidence to apply, but also without the structure of the program, I would never have studied ML the way I have.

However, I do completely agree there are other great programs out there. UIUC and UTexas have great online MSCS degrees that are comparable and well worth considering.

The coursework in OMSCS can vary. There are ways to get through the program taking fairly "easy" courses, and then there are much harder ones. I have certainly had a class or two that was less useful to take than others, but that was mostly so I could graduate in 10 semesters as opposed to taking longer.