Clinical Death != brain dead, Clinical death has a very well defined and nearly irreversible process [1].
The longest human is known to be revived is only in the range 10-15 minutes. Brain damage is quite likely at this point. The longest for an animal is for cat - 1 Hour.
Only clinically dead people are eligible for organ transplantation
That's what I'm concerned about. Clinical death is apparently survivable.
> Reduced body temperature, or therapeutic hypothermia, during clinical death slows the rate of injury accumulation, and extends the time period during which clinical death can be survived. The decrease in the rate of injury can be approximated by the Q10 rule, which states that the rate of biochemical reactions decreases by a factor of two for every 10 °C reduction in temperature. As a result, humans can sometimes survive periods of clinical death exceeding one hour at temperatures below 20 °C.[20] The prognosis is improved if clinical death is caused by hypothermia rather than occurring prior to it; in 1999, 29-year-old Swedish woman Anna Bågenholm spent 80 minutes trapped in ice and survived with a near full recovery from a 13.7 °C core body temperature. It is said in emergency medicine that "nobody is dead until they are warm and dead."[21] In animal studies, up to three hours of clinical death can be survived at temperatures near 0 °C.[22][23]
I'd rather not be harvested too quickly, when I could have been revived without issue.
No doctor/hospital is going to harvest organs unless the person is warm and dead and all reasonable means of revival have been already tried.
Also even if revied would you even want to ? While anna as an exception didn't suffer from brain damage , it is likely, and even she had long term issues with nerve function paralysis etc.
Anna and other similar cases are a extreme rarity. policy shouldn't be made basis a one in a million chance, that's why we have vaccines enforced for example.
You can always opt-out or not opt-in depending in on jurisdiction I am sure.
There are plenty of people who opt for cryogenic storage after they die in the hope technology will evolve to revive them. That's natural step to this argument in a way , what if I could be revived some day even if not today ?
Ultimately handling life and death are intensely personal choices.
> No doctor/hospital is going to harvest organs unless the person is warm and dead
Well, that's the thing. "warm and dead" is above and beyond the criteria you referenced earlier, "clinical death". I'd hope you're right, but I'm not convinced you are. It doesn't seem like it from what I've seen.
And, the cooling factor in brain damage prevention is becoming more widely known these days. Anna wasn't just a fluke.
So on the basis of a Wikipedia article and with no further research, you’re now concerned people are harvesting organs when a person could potentially survive?
[0] is the Australian College of Intensive Care guidelines on organ harvesting. There are strict criteria around when a person is considered dead and for organ donation that means brain death.
I’m not sure what you’re worried about, this was easily discoverable - clinical death is not the criteria that is used for the determination of organ donation eligibility
> So on the basis of a Wikipedia article and with no further research, you’re now concerned people are harvesting organs when a person could potentially survive?
No, I'm asking a question and having a discussion, and you decided to jump in with your hostile skepticism that's completely unwarranted. Chill out.
If you re read your comments, there is a tone of ‘they’re up to something and it can’t be good’. It’s as far from ‘I’m interested in this topic and would like to have a discussion to learn more’ as a QAnon follower is from a PhD student.
I’m not the only one who picked up on it as you can see by the other commenter.
> there is a tone of ‘they’re up to something and it can’t be good’
No, there's a tone of 'exactly how dead is dead'. If you look at the other commenter, sometimes doctors jump the gun.
> far from ‘I’m interested in this topic and would like to have a discussion to learn more’ as a QAnon follower is from a PhD student
Congrats, you've managed to drag in completely unrelated politics.
You're assuming the worst of me. You're comparing me to a Qanon follower, apparently. You're giving (unfounded) credit to a commenter who called me a 'covid vaccine denier'. Seems like you're implying that I'm not acting in good faith.
It's like you're looking for people that fit your preconceptions, and shoehorning me into it. That's prejudice, plain and simple. Chill out.
> No, there's a tone of 'exactly how dead is dead'. If you look at the other commenter, sometimes doctors jump the gun.
No, they don't - you made a misunderstanding which perpetuated a line of questioning which isn't a practical concern. Brain Death + other criteria depending on jurisdiction is a pre-requisite for cadaveric organ donation
As to the rest, you have approached this from the perspective of 'prove to me that X doesn't happen' which is perilously close to that of the antivax/antiscience brigades.
I apologise for thinking the worst of you but I wasn't the only one which perhaps reflects on the approach you have taken in your line of questioning in these highly polarised times
I went back and looked up brain death, and yeah, I made a misunderstanding. Fair enough.
> you have approached this from the perspective of 'prove to me that X doesn't happen'
There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. If I'm thinking of buying a power tool, then 'prove to me that <rapid unplanned disassembly> doesn't happen' is an appropriate tone, and exactly the kind of skeptical questioning that should take place: it's my problem if the problem happens.
I don't care what kind of political climate we're in; you don't get to tell me what kinds of questions I'm not supposed to ask.
The longest human is known to be revived is only in the range 10-15 minutes. Brain damage is quite likely at this point. The longest for an animal is for cat - 1 Hour.
Only clinically dead people are eligible for organ transplantation
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_death