The car was invented in the 1800s, and has seen mature competitors in many other countries like Japan. In the current century, Tesla is the auto giant leaving behind all the legacy manufacturers while also branching into energy products.

Pivotal products are a better milestone than vague estimates of R&D spending.

There's no doubt about Tesla's ability to bring an innovative product to market but they're not a giant by any measure except valuation.

Little known German company ZF has almost double the revenue of Tesla. They also make the transmission for the Porsche Taycan EV that's outselling the 911.

That is a...wildly imaginative take.

Tesla sales are a fraction of any of the big three in terms of sales or revenue.

They sold 192,000 vehicles in the US in 2019. Each of the Big Three sold well over three million.

Tesla currently loses $2500 on every vehicle they sell

And for the numerically challenged like me who like to see visualizations. First line is 200k and second is 3M

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This thread is about innovation, not sales.

How are Tesla more innovative than other companies ? They kicked off a big conceptual change but I don't see that they have a significant technological advantage over other companies like Volvo.

>How are Tesla more innovative than other companies ?

People always seem to compare Tesla technology of tomorrow with what its competitors are doing right now. That's why Volvo "only" has level 3 self-driving, while Tesla has a fleet of robotaxis that are earning you money on its ride-sharing app while you sleep.

I joke, but a large portion of the Tesla fan base has no clue what is going on in the autonomous driving or auto manufacturer world outside of Tesla. Tesla has been a big innovator, but they aren't leaders in everything....not even close.

> "Tesla has been a big innovator"

The thread is about innovation, so that's what counts. And what other manufacturer matches what Tesla has driving on the roads today? The closest realistic challenger is the expensive Porsche Taycan which is still missing all the functionality and usability features.

I mean, I get your point, but unless there are enough sales, pretty soon there will be no money for innovation.

I'm not sure announcing products with no capacity to manufacture them should be considered "innovation".

>Tesla is the auto giant leaving behind all the legacy manufacturers while also branching into energy products

Tesla has sub-1% market share in the global auto market and rapidly declining energy product deployment (they deployed 4x more MW 4 years ago than the did last year). Let's not pretend Tesla has taken over anything yet.