Hacker News new | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submit | fixingproblems's comments login

I say this all the time - programming as a job is not a sustainable life. The fact is that sitting in front of a computer doing mental gymnastics is not in any way something humans are able to cope with over any period of time.

People will say "it's just the managers", "it's because you aren't working on interesting things", etc, but it is none of those things. I have worked on interesting projects, been my own boss, etc, and nothing changes.

In ancient times, you would perform physical activities that you often enjoyed to some degree, at least to the extent that they made you feel good at the end of the day and ready to rest. Most of the time, work and play were indistinguishable. Evolution makes it so that we enjoy the things we are supposed to do. Animals play hunt when they are younger (or even when they are older) because it is fun and that is how their genes make them get good at things they need to do. Their job is hunting for food, and they like doing it.

The further away your job is from your natural tendencies, the worse it gets. Sitting in front of a computer programming and doing other things is about as far away as you can get. Sure, we might like solving problems, etc, but not as a job 9-5 every day.

There are the people who say "stop complaining, you sit in an air-conditioned office! You don't have to toil away in a physical labour job", but that is just completely wrong. Sure, some physical labour jobs will mess up your body, but there is nothing healthy about sitting in air-conditioning staring at a computer. I used to work in a physical labour job when I was younger. I had to quit because they were making sure nobody would get full-time steady work. The difference in my mental and physical state going from outdoors physical (but not extreme, body breaking stuff) to office work was extremely noticeable.


This comment resonates with me but I’ve read on HN from people who’ve done physical labor that an office job is still much more preferable.

Also what you said applies to any office job and not just programming.

Physical labor maybe something that we enjoy but say running a farm requires insane amounts of it day in day out.


My career has looked like tech startup (fullstack programming) -> finance sales -> B2B tech sales -> unskilled labor -> skilled labor (HVAC/Electrician/Plumbing, etc. for OPSEC reasons, won't specify)

Skilled physical labor is where its at.

Unskilled labor is basically a few steps removed from being a slave. 10 hour days (many times 11-12) at bottom-barrel wages, working as fast as you can (because corporate tracks efficiency. Yes, it's actually quantified! HAHA), and getting injured no matter what. It's mind-numbing. I hated it.

Now I've been doing a skilled trade, and I feel rejuvenated from being burnt out of white collar/office shit. Get to work around 6-7am, leave around 2-6pm (depending on workload. Usually it's around 3. However, this is with paid overtime. Once you start making the big bucks, your overtime becomes obscene). If you work for a small shop/family-like environment it's very laid back. You develop the stamina needed in about 6-8 weeks, and after that you get very fast at everything physical you do.

There's a lot of learning involved (especially keeping up with your state's local building code), but once you know the code and how to use the tools, you basically don't need to relearn the latest way to build something, or spend weeks trying to wrap your head around a tool, or hours late at night wracking your brain trying to decipher shitty mandocs and undocumented APIs, or troubleshooting/debugging while simultaneously wanting to blow your brains out.

Everything is simple to learn, troubleshoot, and wrap your head around; it's all in the physical world.

Fuck office jobs. Fuck unskilled labor work. Being a farmer is almost like being a glorified landscaper.

Nonetheless, I don't see myself doing this forever, so I'm working on a side business so I can break out of the labor class, and join my fellow capital-owning brothers.


100% agreed, and well put. Tbh on a very quantitative level, our jobs are fantastic. The lack of that visceral satisfaction is real though, and you turn into an automaton after awhile. Do the work, get the pay, etc. You want to quit and mix it up, but you won't make 1/3rd the same in other jobs.

I think the path is to "ruthlessly compartmentalize" your life. When you are getting the job done, do it well and efficiently, and have things like a standing desk and do stretches and look away from the computer etc. Then when you did enough work for the day, completely do a 180 and go out for a run, practice a language, etc. Make the most of your time.


Join us for AI Startup School this June 16-17 in San Francisco!

Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: